Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Rugby union
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Scope of season articles
[edit]I note that the season articles of the Irish provinces include extensive info on their 'A' teams and women's teams (see 1, 2, 3 and 4). I don't see any reason why the 'A' teams should be included at all, and I would argue that if the women's teams are notable enough to be included on Wikipedia at all, info on their seasons should be in their own articles. There's no reason to clutter up articles that are already crufty with yet more cruft. The articles mentioned above should be about the men's senior teams only. – PeeJay 19:51, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- No to the A, yes to splitting out the women's teams into their own articles. Primefac (talk) 19:59, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Agree with Primefac, although I'm not sure there would be enough coverage for season articles on the Women's sides. Do feel that a lot of the team season articles are quite Crufty. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:01, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Might not be enough for season articles, but very definitely enough to have (e.g.) a Connacht Women article with the seasons listed in them. Could have section links in the {{main}} on the various men's season articles. Primefac (talk) 20:04, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Agree with this, should have separate articles for men's and women's sides now. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:09, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Connaught Rugby Women, Leinster Rugby Women etc in my opinion. But yes all notable for their own article, especially as IRFU have announced expression of interest to join the PWR. All Irish, Scottish and Welsh Celtic Challenge teams also have pages Louis (talk) (contribs) 22:06, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Might not be enough for season articles, but very definitely enough to have (e.g.) a Connacht Women article with the seasons listed in them. Could have section links in the {{main}} on the various men's season articles. Primefac (talk) 20:04, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Agree with Primefac, although I'm not sure there would be enough coverage for season articles on the Women's sides. Do feel that a lot of the team season articles are quite Crufty. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 20:01, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- As the main editor of the Ulster Rugby season articles, I disagree. The appropriate level of coverage of the women's provincial teams, based on the sources available, is as a section in the wider provincial articles. There are enough reliable sources for that, but not enough to create sufficient notability for stand-alone articles, and removing them from where they are currently represented would (a) remove sourced and encylopedic information, and (b) contribute to WP:Systemic bias. I would also argue that, as the Ulster Rugby Awards give awards to both men's and women's players, the banner "Ulster Rugby" covers both the men's and women's teams - they are not separate organisations. The appropriate place to put sourced information about the Ulster women's rugby team is as a sub-section of Ulster Rugby. --Nicknack009 (talk) 22:53, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- Creating separate articles would not imply that the men's and women's teams were separate organisations. Also, I'm not sure how you can say content is noteworthy enough to be included in an article but not as an article of its own. Clearly the coverage is there or you wouldn't be able to adequately source it. The problem is that putting it all in one article makes the scope of that one article way too wide. Including the results of not two but three different teams is confusing to a lay reader. – PeeJay 23:46, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- There's plenty of material that's noteworthy enough to be included in an article but not have an article of its own. I've just hit "Random Article" and gotPolish filmmaker Borys Lankosz. The first section is "Education". It's cited, and is appropriate to include in the article - but that doesn't mean that Education of Borys Lankosz would be noteworthy enough to be a stand-alone article, does it? --Nicknack009 (talk) 01:18, 31 May 2026 (UTC)
- No, but we split off discographies and filmographies when they get larger than the rest of the article. I would note both the Clovers and Wolfhounds have articles. Now just to reiterate my preference, I'm not saying (at the moment) that the 2025–26 Connacht Rugby season § Connacht Women section (which is all of one paragraph long) and others need to be split into their own articles, but the Connacht Women should have their own article that includes that information (in some form). Primefac (talk) 12:12, 31 May 2026 (UTC)
- There's plenty of material that's noteworthy enough to be included in an article but not have an article of its own. I've just hit "Random Article" and gotPolish filmmaker Borys Lankosz. The first section is "Education". It's cited, and is appropriate to include in the article - but that doesn't mean that Education of Borys Lankosz would be noteworthy enough to be a stand-alone article, does it? --Nicknack009 (talk) 01:18, 31 May 2026 (UTC)
- Creating separate articles would not imply that the men's and women's teams were separate organisations. Also, I'm not sure how you can say content is noteworthy enough to be included in an article but not as an article of its own. Clearly the coverage is there or you wouldn't be able to adequately source it. The problem is that putting it all in one article makes the scope of that one article way too wide. Including the results of not two but three different teams is confusing to a lay reader. – PeeJay 23:46, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- As the main editor of the Ulster Rugby season articles, I disagree. The appropriate level of coverage of the women's provincial teams, based on the sources available, is as a section in the wider provincial articles. There are enough reliable sources for that, but not enough to create sufficient notability for stand-alone articles, and removing them from where they are currently represented would (a) remove sourced and encylopedic information, and (b) contribute to WP:Systemic bias. I would also argue that, as the Ulster Rugby Awards give awards to both men's and women's players, the banner "Ulster Rugby" covers both the men's and women's teams - they are not separate organisations. The appropriate place to put sourced information about the Ulster women's rugby team is as a sub-section of Ulster Rugby. --Nicknack009 (talk) 22:53, 30 May 2026 (UTC)
- The Clovers and Wolfhounds are separate from the provinces, and I agree they should not included in the provinces' articles beyond briefly noting which of the province's players were selected for each team. I do note that the main Ulster Rugby article currently does not include any mention of Ulster Women, and currently their coverage is restricted to the season articles, and that does need to be rectified. I think we should start with a section in the main article, and spin it off into its own article if sufficient sourcing for independent notability is established. I'll have a look at that, and what the other provinces need, over the next few days. --Nicknack009 (talk) 07:14, 1 June 2026 (UTC)
- I fear we're departing from the actual subject of this thread. Can I take the above conversation as a consensus that info on matches played by the provinces' 'A' teams and women's teams shouldn't be included in the aforementioned season articles? – PeeJay 10:37, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- No you may not. This discussion has raised issues that have not been resolved, and you have proved today you are not editing or discussing in good faith. I have requested a topic ban at WP:ANI. --Nicknack009 (talk) 17:36, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- They have history of this sort of thing. Louis (talk) (contribs) 19:50, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- @Nicknack009: The discussion has raised issues unrelated to whether or not we include the info on women's games in the articles about the men's teams. Besides, if you ever want to salvage anything, it's always available for you to do so in the edit history. You're the only one who seems to object to the removal of this content, even though a potential solution has been presented. – PeeJay 21:59, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- I think they're quite definitely related. You want to remove the content from the men's articles. Okay, fine. Where do we put that content? That is the "unrelated issue" being discussed above, namely whether we should have an article that holds this information currently in (where I would agree is) the "wrong place". I don't think it should be removed outright from all of Wikipedia, never to be seen again. Primefac (talk) 22:04, 4 June 2026 (UTC)
- As I pointed out previously, thanks to the article's edit history, removing the content doesn't mean it will never be seen again. If it takes a while to work out where to put the information, that's not a problem, we can salvage it; but we agree the article about the men's season is the wrong place and it should be removed from there. – PeeJay 00:07, 7 June 2026 (UTC)
- For the Irish provinces it is NOT the men's seasons, it's the CLUBS seasons. Many sports separate the men's club from the women's club - eg top flight soccer in England where for example Manchester United FC and Manchester United WFC are despite shared branding, separate legal entities.
- That is not the case with Ulster, etc Rugby - there is one entity - the Provincial branch. I'm afraid I agree entirely with NickNack009 on this, and frankly I agree with Louis too - Ypu have a history of what amounts to WP:vandalism on those pages as if you alone ar the final arbiter of notability and style, and as I understand it you are not long back from a lengthy ban for this type of aggresive behaviour previously.
- If the behaviour persits, the ban should probably persist too.
- I support NickNack009's topic ban request, at a bare minimum
- Mpjmcevoybeta (talk) 11:47, 9 June 2026 (UTC)
- What behaviour? We're discussing things. As things stand, the articles have had no significant removal of content. Your accusations are baseless. – PeeJay 11:52, 9 June 2026 (UTC)
- As I pointed out previously, thanks to the article's edit history, removing the content doesn't mean it will never be seen again. If it takes a while to work out where to put the information, that's not a problem, we can salvage it; but we agree the article about the men's season is the wrong place and it should be removed from there. – PeeJay 00:07, 7 June 2026 (UTC)
- I think they're quite definitely related. You want to remove the content from the men's articles. Okay, fine. Where do we put that content? That is the "unrelated issue" being discussed above, namely whether we should have an article that holds this information currently in (where I would agree is) the "wrong place". I don't think it should be removed outright from all of Wikipedia, never to be seen again. Primefac (talk) 22:04, 4 June 2026 (UTC)
- No you may not. This discussion has raised issues that have not been resolved, and you have proved today you are not editing or discussing in good faith. I have requested a topic ban at WP:ANI. --Nicknack009 (talk) 17:36, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- I fear we're departing from the actual subject of this thread. Can I take the above conversation as a consensus that info on matches played by the provinces' 'A' teams and women's teams shouldn't be included in the aforementioned season articles? – PeeJay 10:37, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- The Clovers and Wolfhounds are separate from the provinces, and I agree they should not included in the provinces' articles beyond briefly noting which of the province's players were selected for each team. I do note that the main Ulster Rugby article currently does not include any mention of Ulster Women, and currently their coverage is restricted to the season articles, and that does need to be rectified. I think we should start with a section in the main article, and spin it off into its own article if sufficient sourcing for independent notability is established. I'll have a look at that, and what the other provinces need, over the next few days. --Nicknack009 (talk) 07:14, 1 June 2026 (UTC)
- Do we have a consensus yet on what to do with the 'A' teams at least? Can I please remove the 'A' team results now? – PeeJay 15:26, 14 June 2026 (UTC)
- No objections in the last 10 days. I'm going ahead with it. – PeeJay 19:24, 24 June 2026 (UTC)
Improving coverage of women's rugby in Ireland
[edit]Coming out of the discussion above, I think we need a concerted effort to work out how best to cover women's rugby in Ireland on Wikipedia. We have:
- Ireland women's national rugby union team
- Ireland women's national rugby sevens team
- List of Ireland women's national rugby union team matches
- List of Ireland women's national rugby union players
- Celtic Challenge
- IRFU Women's Interprovincial Series
We need to improve coverage at:
- Rugby union in Ireland
- Ulster Rugby
- Munster Rugby
- Leinster Rugby
- Connacht Rugby
- All-Ireland League (rugby union) (no coverage of the women's division)
We need to consider which competitions are most important in the women's game, rather than simply assume that it maps exactly to what's important in the men's game. As far as I'm aware only the national team is professional, with players centrally contracted. The Celtic Challenge teams feature centrally contracted players and development players drawn from the provincial squads, and play a 10 game season plus two rounds of playoffs. The Interprovincial Series is only four games a year. There's an aspiration to professionalise the provinces and possibly enter them in the PWR. If and when that happens, the women's provincial sides would be notable enough for their own independent articles. But until then, they are probably best covered as sub-sections of the four provinces' articles - that coverage is currently inadequate - and at the Interprovincial Series article.
Any comments from anyone else? --Nicknack009 (talk) 07:32, 2 June 2026 (UTC)
- My initial thought regarding the "improved coverage" part would be that there isn't a ton of coverage about each season for the women (see e.g. 2025–26 Leinster Rugby season § Leinster Women) but what is there isn't so huge that it can't be put into one central article. For example, we could have Leinster Women (or Leinster Women's rugby) have a general summary of the team, and their performance during each season. It would get us started, and if (hopefully when) the women's teams start getting more coverage/press, the articles can be further expanded and potentially split into multiple articles. At the very least this would get the women's information out of the articles on the men's seasons. I'll be honest I hadn't really thought about the top half of your list, but I'll start doing so. Primefac (talk) 22:11, 4 June 2026 (UTC)
- I think "rugby" needs to appear in some form. Whether that’s [[Leinster Women’s Rugby]] or [[Leinster Rugby Women]] (my preference). As the Irish teams are all named after their province, "Leinster Women" on its own is quite ambiguous. Louis (talk) (contribs) 16:00, 5 June 2026 (UTC)
Task: results boxes for a couple of articles
[edit]I just created 1973 Tonga rugby union tour of Australia and Fiji. I assume that is the suitable title, I just used the redlink at Australia national rugby union team. If anyone wants to add results boxes or the infobox type thingos please do. I also noticed 1998 Scotland rugby union tour of Oceania is using raw wikitables rather than {{rugby box}}. Otherwise, I will try to get around to these tasks myself some day. Commander Keane (talk) 08:57, 28 June 2026 (UTC)
20 minute red card v permeant red card
[edit]What is the best way to denote red cards going forward given the clear difference between a 20 min red card and a permeant red card.
The normal so far has been using 
10' for 20 min red cards then having 
30' next to the player that comes on.
But is 10' enough to denote that actually a team is down to 14 player for the rest of the game?
Open discussion.
Rugby.change (talk) 14:16, 11 July 2026 (UTC)
- Use something like <sup>20'</sup> for before 20'
10' or after 10' 20' the red? Not sure if there's a good way of good way of changing the icon to indicate it. Boothy m (talk) 14:57, 11 July 2026 (UTC)
- Not a huge fan of the superscript. Primefac (talk) 15:12, 11 July 2026 (UTC)
- Checked URC, PREM, and RugbyPass, none of them make a distinction between the reds, only thing to denote the difference is there isn't a sub off/on after the 20 minutes for the permanent reds. Primefac (talk) 15:11, 11 July 2026 (UTC)
Article Titles
[edit]Hi rugby lovers. i want to know everyone's opinion on National Rugby teams. i think we should distinguish the national team based their gender. for e.g. India women's national rugby sevens team and India men's national rugby sevens team makes clear that if someone want to look at women's team or men's team. but we have this category specifically for men's teams without the mention of men in the title. should be move the existing articles to distinguish between men's and women's teams? i also posted this on two talk pages (Malaysia team and japan team and then i thought better asking and starting discussion here. thanks -- KuldeepBurjBhalaike (Talk) 07:07, 14 September 2026 (UTC)
The article Spencer Davey has been proposed for deletion because it appears to have no references. Under Wikipedia policy, this biography of a living person will be deleted after seven days unless it has at least one reference to a reliable source that directly supports material in the article. The nominator also raised the following concern:
- only source is a dead link.
If you created the article, please don't be offended. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Referencing for beginners, or ask at the help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the {{prod blp/dated}} tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within seven days, the article may be deleted, but you can request that it be undeleted when you are ready to add one. Bearian (talk) 23:11, 14 October 2026 (UTC)
